Outboard Motors

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Re: Outboard Motors

Postby TIM WEBB » Sun Dec 15, 2013 9:37 pm

Sounds like a good call w/ the Evinrude Keith - not a bad deal! With the standard shaft, just make sure, with the motor clamped directly on the transom, that the cav plate is below the surface at rest. Otherwise you'll get prop cavitation, and if it's water-cooled, the possibility of overheating if the water intake(s) are not submerged 100% of the time ...
Tim Webb
1979 DS2 10099 The Red Witch
(I used to be Her "staff", in the way dogs have owners and cats have staff, but alas no longer ... <pout>)
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Re: Outboard Motors

Postby GreenLake » Mon Dec 16, 2013 1:10 am

KeithS wrote:I have also been thinking of finding a used 40-50 lb freshwater trolling motor. With a battery, that would cost about $250.00. It might also be used occasionally in saltwater, in which case I would rinse it off with fresh water.


For anybody reading this: MinnKota makes a series of motors that are designed for use in Saltwater. RipTide was the series name when I bought mine, and it's held up well to rather frequent salt-water use. Just FYI.
~ green ~ lake ~ ~
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Re: Outboard Motors

Postby KeithS » Sun Jun 08, 2014 3:33 pm

Here are photos of the motor installed on my DSII. We went sailing on Memorial Day at Lake Chesdin, VA. The motor performance well for leaving the dock, and returning to the dock.
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photo 2.JPG (32.52 KiB) Viewed 13744 times
photo 1.JPG
photo 1.JPG (31.84 KiB) Viewed 13744 times
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Re: Outboard Motors

Postby jeadstx » Mon Jun 16, 2014 3:54 pm

On the recently concluded Tx200 I had to use my LEHR 2.5 hp propane motor on the last day more extensivly than planned. The wind was dead ahead in a narrow busy channel and against a 2 to 2.8 knot current. The wind had died completely about a mile before we got to the ICW and we motored to the ICW and up the channel a while until the wind freshened right on our nose. The channel was about a 100 yards wide. We tried tacking and were making very little progress. With a lot of boat traffic we decided to use the motor. The propane motor gets about an hour at full throttle for 1 lb. cylinder of propane. Cylinder was only about 3/4 full when we started motoring before the ICW. We motored till the cylinder ran out and tried to sail again. We could point better than the lug rigged boats in the fleet, but still made poor progress. We put a new cylinder in (turned out it was the one that had been used on the stove during the week) and resumed motoring due to safety concerns of traffic in the channel. The looks we got from passing powerboats as we put a propane cylinder in the motor are priceless. We then turned around to take the DSII under tow that had been taking up the channel for quite some time. Couldn't leave a DS behind. The little 2.5 hp motor was able to push my boat and the tow against the current with ease. Motor started easy and ran smooth.

John
1976 Day Sailer II, #8075 - Completed the 2011, 2012, and 2013 Texas 200
1952 Beetle Boat Swan Catboat
Early Rhodes 19
1973 Mariner 2+2, #2607 - Completed 2014, 2015 and 2016 Texas 200
1969 Day Sailer I, #3229
Fleet 135; Canyon Lake, Texas
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Re: Outboard Motors

Postby K.C. Walker » Mon Jun 16, 2014 8:45 pm

John,

Thanks for the report on the propane motor. It sounds like it was a good addition to take along on the trip.
KC Walker, DS 1 #7002
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Re: Outboard Motors

Postby talbot » Tue Jun 17, 2014 12:29 am

What do you think of the weight of the Lehr? I looked at the specs and looked at it in the store. It seemed really big compared to my little Honda 2hp, which already seems huge to me on the back of the boat. The Honda weighs less than 30lbs, but it noticeably tips the boat to the port side. I suppose if you are packed with 100's of lbs of camping gear, 20 lbs here or there is nothing, but (unfortunately), we're not out overnight very often.
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Re: Outboard Motors

Postby jeadstx » Tue Jun 17, 2014 11:46 am

The 2.5 hp LEHR weighs 37 lbs. I don't really notice a problem with it back there, but then again, I'm a big man and I screw up the trim of the boat all on my own. I try to offset the weight of the motor by storing things like anchors to the opposite side as the motor.

John
1976 Day Sailer II, #8075 - Completed the 2011, 2012, and 2013 Texas 200
1952 Beetle Boat Swan Catboat
Early Rhodes 19
1973 Mariner 2+2, #2607 - Completed 2014, 2015 and 2016 Texas 200
1969 Day Sailer I, #3229
Fleet 135; Canyon Lake, Texas
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Re: Outboard Motors

Postby SailinMick » Tue Jul 01, 2014 8:06 am

Skippa wrote:Now that the boat is in storage, I am looking at my "To Do" list. There is a 2.5 hp outboard for sale near me at a fair price. My concern is the 15 inch shaft length. Without the opportunity for sea trials until spring I am putting this upgrade on hold. Unless !
Does any one have any experience they would like to share in regard to the small portable outboards on the market. Suzuki and Mercury are both available with 15 in shaft length.
Boat is DS11
Thanks in advance.
Kevin


Kevin,
New to the party, but I have to confess (coming fm owning a rebel formerly, w/dramatically more freeboard), when I sold the reb., I kept the OB.
It's a very late model 5hp Honda (Silver) 4 stroke, 4 hp.
On the Reb (which is all I have to draw on here, because the DS is a while fm. hitting the H20) I had a light grade swing down bracket.
IF You have problems in choppy seas (which I never did, even at the highest 'down' setting...basically straight back for the adjustable bracket), You can always lower it, about 3-4" w/every notch on the bracket.
IF You're getting a motor in the 'dirt cheap' category, for goodness sakes contemplate getting and installing a lighter hp rated swing down bracket (keeping an eye out of CL and at the local flea markets/yard sales I've snagged them for as little as $40-$50 while taking the time to confirm that they still worked fine and moved freely through all the different height/depth settings), for with a properly mounted one, You can run from less than a 15" shaft past 25" so the equivalent of fm. short shaft to extra long shaft, at the click of a 10 second re-adjustment (if You were really slow & rusty w/it's operation) so my answer for You is to find a better bracket....then 'any' motor will do (although I have to admit, the 5hp, on the reb which was significantly heavier than a DS, I only ran it at more than 50% throttle about thrice...in front of T-Storms and being a floating lightning rod never appealed to us; HP is a funny thing. More is better when You need it, and quieter when You don't; just pay close attention to the weight because frankly bigger than 5hp is probably overkill).
HTH,
-Mick
Only posting here because the weather must stink for messing about boats today!
Southerner by Birth, Sailor by the Grace of God (& a thoughtful Grandfather)
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Re: Outboard Motors

Postby SailinMick » Tue Jul 01, 2014 8:33 am

KeithS wrote:I think I am leaning away from the British Seagull. I've read other forums about those, and there seems to be a love/hate relationship with those motors. The noise and the pollution they produce is a concern, especially on the lake we started sailing on this past summer.

I found an 8 to 10 years year 2 hp Evinrude with a standard shaft, that swivels 360 degrees (for reverse), with an integral gas tank for $250. I think I might go look at that.

I have also been thinking of finding a used 40-50 lb freshwater trolling motor. With a battery, that would cost about $250.00. It might also be used occasionally in saltwater, in which case I would rinse it off with fresh water.

At the moment, I'm thinking a small gas outboard might be a better choice. Once we get more experience, we might venture out to other places in eastern Virginia, where current could be a problem for a trolling motor.


don't get me wrong, I LOVE my Seagull Super 40 (4hp), and there are a few things You need to keep in mind:
1-They're the equivalent to an 'extra-extra' long shaft;
2-refilling the tank over a bobbing transom in choppy seas can be a challenge;
3-they are 10to1 (<--NOT A TYPO) mixture on the 2 stoke motor oil to gasoline (which makes for something this side of those mosquito fogger trucks when running)
4-per #3 above, IF you're using it to compete or survive in a busy channel, draw bridge or other restricted navigation location, where the wind is off Your stern, that 'fogging' will have the entire crew gagging something fierce;
5-You should ONLY run marine (read=Non-Ethanol) gasoline in these, and finally:
6-while changing the plug is so easy it's child's play; the points are a completely different story.
They are famous for reliability, and I really do love mine. I wouldn't think of hanging it on the back of the DS unless I was a complete masochist.

They're a blast to operate, I've run this one on the back of a 25' vintage (1962) Columbia Sloop (w/lots more freeboard and cockpit space so relocating to avoid the 'fog' was totally manageable) but they're heavy, smoky, and awkward if You're not intimately familiar w/them. & then again, mine's from 1948...10 years Older than the DS! (& me too!)
-Mick
Only posting here because the weather must stink for messing about boats today!
Southerner by Birth, Sailor by the Grace of God (& a thoughtful Grandfather)
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Re: Outboard Motors

Postby jeadstx » Tue Jul 01, 2014 2:50 pm

I have to say that is one thing nice about the Lehr propane outboard, no smell. You can use either a 1 lb. bottle or an external tank. Don't have to deal with ethanol either.

John
1976 Day Sailer II, #8075 - Completed the 2011, 2012, and 2013 Texas 200
1952 Beetle Boat Swan Catboat
Early Rhodes 19
1973 Mariner 2+2, #2607 - Completed 2014, 2015 and 2016 Texas 200
1969 Day Sailer I, #3229
Fleet 135; Canyon Lake, Texas
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Re: Outboard Motors

Postby GreenLake » Tue Jul 01, 2014 5:43 pm

John, why don't you open a topic just on the Lehr and collect all the info you acquired about how to really make that one go. There are some undocumented or poorly documented "tricks" with that one, knowing which makes the users' experience quite different.
~ green ~ lake ~ ~
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Re: Outboard Motors

Postby jeadstx » Tue Jul 01, 2014 6:31 pm

I really need more experience with it, although the Tx200 provided some good use this year. Once it is operating, it pretty much like most 2-4 hp motors without a reverse gear. I actually was suprised that my crew didn't know that to go in reverse that you turn the head 180 degrees, which also works on gas motors without a reverse. I'm still learning things about it. I need a little more time with it before creating a separate post I think. I am pleased with it's performance so far tho.

John
1976 Day Sailer II, #8075 - Completed the 2011, 2012, and 2013 Texas 200
1952 Beetle Boat Swan Catboat
Early Rhodes 19
1973 Mariner 2+2, #2607 - Completed 2014, 2015 and 2016 Texas 200
1969 Day Sailer I, #3229
Fleet 135; Canyon Lake, Texas
jeadstx
 
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Re: Outboard Motors

Postby talbot » Wed Jul 02, 2014 5:46 pm

I worried about the short/long shaft for a long time, and at this point am glad I went with the short shaft because it is lighter and easier to manage. The short shaft does require an external bracket. Notching a fixed mounting plate to lower the motor seems to be standard procedure. I think the details of engine operation that people have raised are important, and some of that has to do with assumptions about your sailing. For instance, I appreciate the less-than-30lbs of my Honda 2hp because it is a true auxiliary, intended for use in calm wind and against currents for short periods of time. A heavy chop could lift the cavitation plate out of the water, and the thought of having to full the little gravity-feed fuel tank in rough water is scary. (I repurposed an old 1-liter backpacking fuel bottle with a little vented pour spout after the first time I had to refuel under way.)
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Re: Outboard Motors

Postby jeadstx » Fri Jul 18, 2014 1:02 pm

A note on the capability of the Lehr propane motor. I downloaded my GPS track data fro the Tx200 the other day. The data contained my speed data as well as position. On the last day when we were going past Port O'Conner, the wind was head on coming straight down the channel and the tide was coming in giving us over a 2 mph current in the channel. My motor is 2.5 hp, I was sailing my 19' Mariner this year which weighs a little more than twice the Day Sailer. On the track after we took the Day Sailer doing the event under tow, we were still able to go about 2 mph (according to the data) up the channel.

John
1976 Day Sailer II, #8075 - Completed the 2011, 2012, and 2013 Texas 200
1952 Beetle Boat Swan Catboat
Early Rhodes 19
1973 Mariner 2+2, #2607 - Completed 2014, 2015 and 2016 Texas 200
1969 Day Sailer I, #3229
Fleet 135; Canyon Lake, Texas
jeadstx
 
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Re: Outboard Motors

Postby talbot » Fri Jul 18, 2014 2:40 pm

Good to know. From discussions with other sailors, it seems like most auxiliaries are expected to push sailboats at about 4 knots. Does that seem right? It's an important assumption for sailing around river bars, where currents can be 5 knots or more. An auxiliary can't replace the local tide table.
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