New member with a 1968 DS1(rigging pics pg 6-7)

Topics primarily or specifically about the DS1. Many topics are of general interest, so please use forum sections on Rigging, Sails, etc. where appropriate.

Moderator: GreenLake

Re: New member with a 1968 DS1(rigging pics pg 6-7)

Postby tomodda » Thu Jul 16, 2020 11:43 pm

Hi Nick:

Great pics, glad you have everything rigged up. Also glad that my links were of some use, there is tons of information on this forum. Now get out there and sail! As GreenLake is gently hinting to you, don't worry too much about the details, learn to walk before you can run. The beauty of sailing is that the more you know, the more there is to learn, it's a life-long journey. A few belated thoughts and comments, for what they are worth:

-Your green line (#5) is the VANG, not the cunningham. The Boom Vang is a very essential control, especially on our little DaySailers. When I was growing up, we used the Vang to keep the boom from rising up when running off the wind and that's it (your setup is rigged for just that, tell you why in a sec). Turns out that the Vang does so much more, it's the essential control for shaping the main upwind and down. It does so much! Leech tension, sail twist, mast bend, flattening the main, even affects the jib. Have you ever driven a stick-shift (manual) car? Think of the mainsheet like the gas pedal and the vang like your stick-shift - the sheet for power, the vang for HOW you apply your power. We've had plenty of discussions on this forum about using the vang (search for "vang sheeting" and just "vang"), and I thank GreenLake for really opening my eyes on how to use it. When used properly, the vang takes on a LOT of tension. Your vang setup is 5-1, which is barely adequate - 12-1 is more like it, and mine is 20-1. Not saying you need to upgrade tomorrow, just saying that you'll eventually want to. More immediately, you'll want a cam-cleat for the vang instead of your V-cleat. You'll never get the vang off the v-cleat under tension, and it'll eventually destroy your rope. Again, do some sailing first, and your setup is fine for running off the wind, where there is less tension. But soon enough, you'll want to replace that cleat. In the meantime, some light reading:

-Ahem, you're doing it wrong with your barber haulers. You want to set them up so that the lines cross over from Port to Starboard and vice-versa. Why? Because when you are sitting on the high side (windward), you don't want to have to reach over to the low side (leeward) to work the barber hauler. If you cross the lines over, then you'll have the end of the hauler right at hand. Your jam-cleats (the black resin ones) are also backwards, you'll want the jaws to face outboard, instead of inboard like they are now. As long as you are repositioning the jam cleats, you may want to put them on the rear lip of the cuddy opening - the short little "wall" hanging down Why? Because where you have it now, the jib is apt to "hook" towards the mainsail, throwing wind onto the wrong side of the sail. Remember, the whole point of the barber haul is to closely fit the curve of the back part (leech) of the jib to the curve of the mainsail - when you look down the "slot" (space between the main and the jib), you should see two parallel curves about 18-ish inches apart. Pull on the barber hauler and you narrow the gap, which can be very good in the right conditions (there's an art to it). Again, (race)car analogy, it's like an adjustable front air dam/lip spoiler - controls the air flow. Unless you hook your jib, then it destroys the flow! Set your controls close at hand but away from the jib clew (back corner), back lip of the cuddy is perfect. Personally, I have my barber haulers attach 9 inches off the centerline, going further outboard would allow the clew to ride too high, further inboard tightens the leech. But this is easily changed later (just move the cleat), so don't sweat it. Beware, space is tight behind the cuddy lip because there's a length of rebar right there, holding up the roof... drill carefully, don't expose the rebar (or it'll rust later). Use a longish machine screw (2 inches or so), washers and a lock nut. The barber hauler doesn't get a lot of tension on it (25ish pounds at most), so use a thin screw, #6 or #8 is fine. For more reading, see my PPS below.

-Did you rig your aft "traveler" yet? The one from your sketch? If not, and if I may make the suggestion, hold off on that for now. Tie the two ends of the aft bridle (triangle) together and put'em on a hook, like GreenLake and Phil Root do. Or, if you have cleats at the back of your boat, just tie each end of your bridle to those. Keep it simple, for now. Once you've learned how to sail, you'll want to play with the height of the rear mainsheet block off the deck before you worry about adjusting side-to-side. Mine is about 18" of the rear deck, when I'm reaching or running I wish it would be higher and when it's blowing hard I wish it would be less, but it's a good compromise. GreenLake's setup with a hook is a good, SIMPLE way to adjust that, either on (short) or off (long). If you want more adjustability, try a Crosby RIg Bridle. Your proposed traveller and pulley system is great if you want to bring the mainsheet block upwind of the centerline, but... honestly... I've never needed to do that in two years of sailing the DS. The VANG is the control you really need, not the traveler. Now, all boats are different - my old quarter-tonner absolutely required me to sail with the traveler to windward of the center, and it was a "nice-to-have" feature on my catamarans. Everyone also has a different preferred style. You may want a fully-adjustable up-and-down, side-to-side rear bridle one day, some folks do it exactly like you are proposing (that sure looks like a typical setup for a Thistle). But again, learn to walk before you run, K.I.S.S..... Once more, some light reading:

-The jib-downhaul is great to have, my first few sails without one were very frustrating as the jib kept trying to ride back up the forestay (the wind blows it up) after I doused it.That being said, you can - and want to - use a much thinner line. Windage (drag) and weight are to be avoided, so you want the thinnest you can get that won't cut your hands. I use 2mm spectra braided line, really thin stuff, but anything small that you have laying around is fine. The downhaul is one of the few places where you can go really small (or go home!), spiderwebs would almost do the trick. At a later date, let's talk about my 2:1 reverse purchase jib downhaul. :wink: GL wrote that it's overkill (or words to that effect, but I love it.

-Did you rig a mainsail outhaul yet? That's next.....

Man, I'm getting pretty far into the weeds here, sorry! But you're the one who decided to rig the "fancy" controls. You don't need barber hauler, vang, etc to SAIL, just get out there and have fun. And believe me you WILL be changing your rig in the future, constantly. That''s the fun of the DS, there is always something you can tweak and it won't break the bank to do it. Go sail!

All the best,


P.S.: What's with line #6, your below-deck jib tensioner? What's it attached to, exactly? Just wondering. I've rigged a jib-halyard tensioner on my DS (using a setup I stole from Hobie-Cats), but it's completely different. Again, this is not a control you need right now, but I'm curious.

Again for what it's worth, I just wrote that tweaking the rig on a DS is cheap (won't break bank) - my jib halyard tensioner was the most expensive single control I've rigged on the boat, cost me just shy of $100. Coulda done it much cheaper, but I wanted it MY WAY, so I treated myself to an early birthday present last year. But you really don't have to spend a lot. Ebay and used boat parts stores are the way to go. And my favorite hardware makers -

P.P.S: <Cut/Paste from North Sails Daysailer Tuning Guide> Dave Keran, Day Sailer National Champion, describes his method and set-up of using his inhaulers below. Thanks, David!

“The barberhaulers exit from through-deck bullseyes on the vertical face on the aft end of the cuddy. The exits are about 8” from centerline and lines cross to the other side of the boat from where they exit. We sail with the barberhauler block positioning the jibsheet 12” off centerline which means the block is 20” from the bullseye. I believe that the position of the bullseye (both fore and aft and laterally) and the length of the barberhauler line are important in getting the right trim on the jib. If the lines exit forward, on the top of the cuddy, they cause the jib to cup into the main when closehauled and the shape becomes less than optimal. Secondly if jib is pulled down to the cuddy either by a short line or to a track with a block I think the leach gets too tight. By allowing the barberhauler block to float I feel the jib is properly tensioned on the leach and the foot.”
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Re: New member with a 1968 DS1(rigging pics pg 6-7)

Postby igotit » Fri Jul 17, 2020 12:22 am

Nice post tom
To clarify #5 is my cunninghan,green line run thru a deck block and up the mast about 20" into another block,with hook.
#6 follows cabin top,under front deck to pull tension on the jib.

Onto the vang....i think mine is on backwards and outta was installed that way when i recieved it......not implying its right by any means.
I was questioning just todat about the vang and its length of line.i just took a few pictures,but my power just went out so no wifi to run my computer to put em up.cant do it from my phone.
I also agree on basic sailing for boat has more control adjustments than whats needed.
And i also plan on moving the barber hauler cleats to the cabin top lip,as seen in the link you posted by phil.
i assure you guys im taking the advice and absorbing as much as i can before hitting the water.

And yes my traveler is all setup and cleated off to stay center for the time being.
Never measured my triangle height,but guessing its around 22" or more
Ill re read your post a few times to make sure i understand everything correctly,and i do thank you for explaining as much as you did.

my the top under the boom you can see my tail for the vang control......its not is in the more slack on it.
i say the vang is backwards due to no slack left,and the slack with knot tied thats in the sheve doesnt actually run over a pully.its just place over the last part of line to keep it from hanging on deck.again like that when i bought her.
its either backwards or i need to spin 180 with both blocks to allow the slack to run out ontop the deck vs its current out the top.

Image20200716_230550 by Nick Pellegrin, on Flickr
my #5 green cunningham,which may or may not be setup correctly
Image20200716_230612 by Nick Pellegrin, on Flickr
my #6 runs under cabin and deck,attaches to jib
Image20200716_230629 by Nick Pellegrin, on Flickr
Image20200708_143453 by Nick Pellegrin, on Flickr
and a wider view of my vang and cunningham.has a hook on it hokked on cleat.
Image20200716_230640 by Nick Pellegrin, on Flickr
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Re: New member with a 1968 DS1(rigging pics pg 6-7)

Postby igotit » Fri Jul 17, 2020 1:00 am

i want to apologize for my typing errors,and misspelled keyboard is very small and my fat fingers dont cooperate very well.
i have severe nerve damage in both arms,hands.....ontop of that dyslexia that seems to be getting worse with age.
not fun being a forcefully retired 26 year mechanic that cant get his fingers to work properly..... :lol:
so please bear with me.

ive just undone the restrung my vang and rotated the vang 180 degrees....seems to be correct now at a 4:1 ratio with just enough slack to cleat her off.i may wind up going with a longer rope later on.....and add a dedicated cleat for it.
the way shes setup at the moment the vang and cunningham share a v cleat.....which will be an issue if i have to use both.i suppose i could always cleat cunningham somewhere else thou.

how it was with the slack passed over a part of line and knotted off to keep it there.
Image20200716_234609 by Nick Pellegrin, on Flickr
and how she sits after undoing the knot and rotating the complete vang 180 degrees.
Image20200716_235101 by Nick Pellegrin, on Flickr
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Re: New member with a 1968 DS1(rigging pics pg 6-7)

Postby GreenLake » Fri Jul 17, 2020 4:29 am

Your barber hauler cleats: just swap turn them around and have the haulers cross each other on deck. Otherwise, there's nothing wrong with the location.

For your vang, you want enough of a tail so you can let it all out, but still be able to reach it from the cockpit. I run mine backwards, because the built-in cleat in min cannot be released if it's at the mast end (wrong angle of pull).


You might want to think about adding a 2:1 cascade. I remember you were writing about your sailing area as having plenty wind. One of the best ways to depower the main is to tighten the vang and then easing the sheet. In stronger winds you'll want something more than 4:1.
~ green ~ lake ~ ~
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Re: New member with a 1968 DS1(rigging pics pg 6-7)

Postby igotit » Sun Jul 26, 2020 3:01 pm

last night i broke out the 8x10 heavy duty poly tarp.its fits nicely.took about 5 mins to rig it utilizing the current equipment already installed.
the rear i ran my boats tie down lines (dock lines)thru the spinaker blocks,thru the eye on the tarp.i cleated off the rear.took the slack from the rope and past it thru the tarp eyes till midship.then passed thru the lil blocks and spinaker cam cleats.the remaining slack from my rear dock line went thru the next eye up and tied off to the lil hook with the rubber latch.then used my bow line to pull the slack over the cabin top.also just attatched cunningham to peak to lift the front and take out more slack.
all my dock lines are 16.6ft in length.i bought 50ft and divided into 3 lines.

should work nicely for now.its already serving its purpose,rain all night and today.....inside nice n dry.
looking foward to fall when temp hit 60s at night to go sleep in the lake after a sail.
I rigged all from outside the boat.ill try to take down a rig from inside.if its too much work next option will be bungies or some diy pvc pipe hooks.
Image20200726_110929 by Nick Pellegrin, on Flickr
Image20200726_011237 by Nick Pellegrin, on Flickr
ive tightened the main halyard after this pic to pull more slack out.
Image20200726_011249 by Nick Pellegrin, on Flickr
Image20200726_012322 by Nick Pellegrin, on Flickr
Image20200726_012331 by Nick Pellegrin, on Flickr
Image20200726_012352 by Nick Pellegrin, on Flickr
Image20200726_012358 by Nick Pellegrin, on Flickr
Image20200726_012406 by Nick Pellegrin, on Flickr
Image20200726_012429 by Nick Pellegrin, on Flickr
Image20200726_012437 by Nick Pellegrin, on Flickr
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Re: New member with a 1968 DS1(rigging pics pg 6-7)

Postby igotit » Wed Jul 29, 2020 8:39 pm

got the tarp fitting better,bought some more shock cord and some bungie hooks that fit the rub rail perfect.
easy to install in 5 mins from inside the me a total covered area 5x12.
yesterday had 20-25 mph winds,held up just fine.

and flickr giving me the warning im reaching my 1000 free photo limit and will be locked soon,unless i pay $4.99 mth.

Image20200729_183304 by Nick Pellegrin, on Flickr
Image20200729_183311 by Nick Pellegrin, on Flickr
Image20200729_183321 by Nick Pellegrin, on Flickr
Image20200729_183334 by Nick Pellegrin, on Flickr
Last edited by igotit on Sun Aug 09, 2020 9:56 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: New member with a 1968 DS1(rigging pics pg 6-7)

Postby BlackPirate » Sun Aug 09, 2020 7:53 am

Old boat is really interesting, Thanks for sharing Nick and welcome to the forum. :D
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Re: New member with a 1968 DS1(rigging pics pg 6-7)

Postby igotit » Sun Aug 16, 2020 9:52 am

No problem on sharing
Havent been able to get out for first sail.poor weather and most of all my local waterways are clogged with thick vegetation,worst ive ever way my lil motor can plow thru it.
I did find a launch right next to the lake,but $7 launch fee.
May have to pay it if this vegetation holds up.
Nothing new to add......except i really wanna get out on the water.
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Re: New member with a 1968 DS1(rigging pics pg 6-7)

Postby tomodda » Sun Aug 16, 2020 11:40 am


Just staring at Google Satellite Map a little, what about here:

29°21'25.8"N 90°37'36.8"W
29.357178, -90.626897

Or here:

29°20'24.5"N 90°38'15.4"W
29.340126, -90.637614

Cut/Paste the Lat/Long into Google Maps and you should see what I spotted. Both look like gravel ramps, no idea who owns them. The first one looks more promising, although may be private. Both right on the lake, anyhow.

And then, for really wild, there's this:

29°22'08.7"N 90°37'30.7"W
29.369084, -90.625203

Of course, I have no way of knowing if that particular spit of sand still exists, or if your car/truck can handle it. But my point is that the great advantage of the DS is that it''ll float in nearly no water, and it's light enough to push off/winch back onto the trailer. You CAN beach-launch it, especially if you have a tilting trailer. I see you really dont have any beaches in your neck of the woods, put plenty of old dike roads leading off into the lake. Maybe?
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Re: New member with a 1968 DS1(rigging pics pg 6-7)

Postby igotit » Sun Aug 16, 2020 12:08 pm

those are all private boat launches used by duck hunters and sport fisherman.the surrounding waters at those launches are shallow marshs 6" and upto 2ft deep.i know this area very well,as a kid thats all we had to do was ride boats n fish,explore.....gas was cheap back then.
closest public launch by the lake is sharks landing......$7 thou.
98% of launches here are private,and most cases owners arent there year round,usually locked gates block you.poeple from all over the us buy properties and use them as camps/weekend get aways,summer getting permission isnt easy.

sharks isnt a very good option because the docks are used by commercial fisherman and never room to tieup your boat while you park.....if theres a parking spot open.
but it is close to the lake,and would solve my vegetation problem.ill try to get a pic of the vegetation im referring to,its about 2ft tall and thick enough to walk ok without falling thru.
its by far the worst ive ever seen it in over 30 years.
in this sat image of sharks,its empty....must have been a sunday lmao,that place is always packed. ... 90.6206578

there is a launch ive used before,its always open gate,but sign posted "private launch"i launch my dads boat there,but we dont leave a vehicle parked in fear of being towed.just a simple launch,dad drives boat home a few miles home where his boat stays in the water 8 mths at a time. ... a=!3m1!1e3
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Re: New member with a 1968 DS1(rigging pics pg 6-7)

Postby igotit » Sun Feb 21, 2021 9:37 pm

well........its about time.
this whole year (from last march till now)has been very busy,storms,windy all the time,work.....ect.tired of making excuses and decided to go out and try basic forcast was great sunny skies with occasional clouds and 5-10 knot i done a pre launch check,setup the ds1 as if i was ready to sail,made some on land practice sails (i refer to it as a yard sail :lol: )....all was well.launched and traveled lil over 4 miles to get to the lake....nice and sunny.
as soon as i lifted the genoa and got going the winds picked up and clouds were rolling in i wasnt confident enough to set out the main.
so i played with the genoa for about 10-11 miles going back and forth across the guys warned me she doesnt sail well with only 1 sheet.ill say she sailed well but was unable to jib on close haul into the wind.with 1 sail id lose speed right before bow was about to switch over the wind id come to a hault and blown back on orginal heading before attempting the jib.
with genoa only i was limited from 2 oclock to 10 oclock headings,couldnt get her to swing between 11-1 oclock.
so this meant my upwind travel was restricted unless i wanted long sweeping zig zags.
after 2 hours of playing wind was 15-19 knots and not letting up so ran asfar as i could into the shallow water to evade the swells and chop.didnt film that part,it was rough water,wet,lots of heel over on the boat.but boy was she moving along nicely.7mph was my top speed for first 2 hours,4 was average speed.during the rough last 30 mins i wasnt playing with my gps or camera....but certin i was on plane a few times exceeding 9 mph.
with all that said it was very enjoyable,and cant wait for the time and weather to go back and do it all again.ive got a both jib sheet cams that need replacing,and tweak the location,and put more tension on the centerboard.quite a few times she closed to about half during sail,mostly when i got above 5mph.
and the jib downhaul that i glad i had it today.i also waited till i was in the lake to set the jib out on deck,most do this at dock.....i wanted to do it out on the water .....incase i ever had know what i was getting was rather easy.

please enjoy the video,its nothing exciting to you experienced guys.....but it was very exciting for me.
im sure theres alot ive coulda done differently,made better trims,use barber was just basic get out there and do it.
the boat is in bad need of cleaning,shes been under a tarp sinc the october hurricane.
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Re: New member with a 1968 DS1(rigging pics pg 6-7)

Postby tomodda » Mon Feb 22, 2021 6:08 pm

Hi Nick!

Enjoyed the video, thanks for posting it. I'm jealous, wish I was out sailing. And that was your FIRST time? Not bad, not bad at all. That being said, is it OK to help you out with some nautical terms? I'm certainly not one to criticize, but if you want to talk sailing, it helps if we're all speaking the same language. I'll wait for your reply before I write anything about that.

Another thought is that I prefer to raise the main first and sail with main only if I feel wind too strong. I'll throw in some caveats here that a wind which seems a bit much when sailing alone is just fine with an extra crew-member aboard - the extra weight keeps life manageable. Sailing under main alone is also difficult but not impossible to tack (swing boat thru the eye of the wind/directly into the wind). But the real reason to do it is to have a boat with weather helm rather than lee helm. What does that mean? Think of the boat like a weathervane, with the axis (turning point) in the middle, at the centerboard. If you put up a sail in the front of you "weathervane", then it will try to turn away from the wind; if you put up a sail at the back of your "weathervane" then it will turn toward the wind. When we are sailing, ideally we have both sails up and balanced, so neither turning towards or away from the wind. But, if I have to chose, I'd rather have a boat that has a tendency to turn towards the wind, because then I can control it, we're turning towards a more stable position - this is called a WEATHER helm. If the boat has a tendency to turn away from the wind - LEE helm - then the wind pushes you with more and more force, making the boat heel more, get out of control, etc. Even in a balanced boat (both sails up), you want to tune your sails to give you a slight weather helm. Kind of like a jetski going in a circle and auto-throttling back to neutral if you let go of the handlebars. So.. sailing under foresails alone - lee helm, under main alone - weather helm. Weather helm good.

We can discuss how to tack a boat under main alone some other time (shift your body weight at the right moment... "roll tack") but in the meantime, don't be embarrassed to just gybe (jibe) 180 degrees around the other way. That way you swing the stern of the boat thru the wind instead of the bow. Be careful of the boom flipping from one side to the other faster than you want (keep control of it by holding the sheets), but other than that, it solves the problem of tacking the boat when you don't have a foresail.

All the best,

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Re: New member with a 1968 DS1(rigging pics pg 6-7)

Postby igotit » Tue Feb 23, 2021 8:17 am

Feel free to correct me at anyime,i need to learn.
Im in a bit of a rush,bout to head to work sorry for short reply.
I do thank you for taking the time to explain weather helm.....makes alotta sense.
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Re: New member with a 1968 DS1(rigging pics pg 6-7)

Postby GreenLake » Tue Feb 23, 2021 7:34 pm

I was going to reply, but then I reread your post and wasn't sure of my conclusions.

The wave state (and when you show it, your wake) in the video don't look like extreme conditions, but I understand that you may have filmed during a calmer period.

I don't see extensive white caps on the water in the video. They usually start showing up around 11 knots and do require a bit of fetch to develop, but your lake seems large enough. The waves look a little higher than what I'm used to, but our lake doesn't have enough fetch to allow the full wave height everywhere. (And wave heights are tough to read from a video). Your wake, at the time you show it, looks like you are doing around or a bit over 4 knots. From about five, it should look more like the wake from a motorboat.

I do see that you have a vang to flatten your main. Given that, you should have been fine sailing to around 14 knots of wind with both jib and main. You may need to not only sit on the side deck, but hike out a bit. Hiking straps are useful for that. With the vang tight, you can let out the mainsheet without changing the sail shape. That depowers the boat. You can then trim it in just as much as is possible before the heeling moment is more than you can balance.

If it's an occasional gust, I can usually manage to handle it with that technique to some wind speed beyond 14. Perhaps up to 20. But if the sustained wind gets close to that upper range, or the gusts are frequent, or have large shifts in direction, or are much stronger than the lulls, I would put a reef in. If you put a reef in, as long as you make sure the new foot is nice and flat, you'll find that you no longer have to fight to keep the boat upright.

The reef moves the "center of effort" or effective location of the sail force down, reducing the heeling arm and reduces the surface and hence the heeling force. So you are reducing both factors that multiply to determine the heeling moment. In fact, in marginal conditions, you might try to start out with a reef (and shake it out if you feel you really don't need it). In very variable winds, if you've reefed for the gusts, the boat will be a bit sluggish in the lulls, but you aren't a racer.

I did not see the telltale dark streaks on the water signifying gusts in your video. Quite possible that I missed them, but in certain conditions the wind might be fairly steady and not fluctuate as much. If so, the range and frequency of adjustments needed on your main might be less than in more blustery conditions. Which would make it a good training wind.

Finally, if you sail with both jib and main, it's easy to luff up a bit in a gust, just sailing slightly more upwind than what the sails are trimmed for. That also takes power out of the sails.

Overall, from your description, it sounds like you had a vigorous fun day.
~ green ~ lake ~ ~
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Re: New member with a 1968 DS1(rigging pics pg 6-7)

Postby igotit » Tue Feb 23, 2021 9:33 pm

I didnt film during the last 30 mins of sail,they had white caps and 2-3ft swells.once i got in shallower waters around 5ft deep i pulled the sail and motored to about 3-4ft water and winds started to die,thats when i filmed back on motor and called it a day.i took a shortcut out the lake into a big connecting pond on east bank of was 2-3ft deep and alot calmer for the next 2 miles.
Why i chose genoa only
I was worried the main would have been hard to handle with no experience.but my intentions were genoa first,travel about 2 miles,then main.but i was comfortable with the speed i was going with gen only,had lack of control when trying to close haul thou.sailed nicely broad,and beam reach and downwind.
Had alotta trouble with jib cam cleats,cleats need to be angled.due to being flat on deck the sheets were pulling upward angle not gripping in the cams that well,and pulling out.something ill try to correct before next i knew playing with main,plus the aggrevation of fighting with tiller tammer,plus increasing winds.i was playing safe and only 1 sail for this round.
Also centerboard kept closing on me.
But my next sail will involve the main.
And the video doesnt do justice for water conditions,it never does.while i was editing that vid i was thinking it was rougher than the video shows.
Really wish i woulda put aside money to buy new sails and have reefs installed,but now im at a point that ill just have to use what ive got for awhile living on a budget.
But i did enjoy it so very much,cant wait to do it again.
But i already have a full week of work plus weekend side jobs to take care of.
So if i cant get back out this weekend,ill try n plan for next weekend if weather is good.
I was very excited,and still excited about that first time out.
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