Halyard issues and Mast Step

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Halyard issues and Mast Step

Postby tc53 » Sun Aug 02, 2015 5:12 pm

A few years ago, I swapped out my old rope/wire main and jib halyards for all-rope, using Dyneema for both. Losing the eye in the jib halyard's rope-to-wire connection, I also lost any way of hooking my 4-1 jib halyard tensioning system. The various attempted fixes for this have been unsatisfactory and unreliable. Also, the main halyard, led and cleated to an under-thwart cam on the starboard side, tends to pop out of the cam on a regular basis (especially on windy days). So, I am considering reinstalling my old rope/wire halyards. Any suggestions?

Another mast-related question I posted a while ago in another thread:

My DS 1 mast steps on the keel, into a fitting that allows for several different fore/aft positions for pre-bend. Between the bottom of the actual mast and the fitting is a detachable metal cast (aluminum, I think) base which houses the three blocks for internally routed jib, main, and spinnaker halyards. The bottom on this detachable base fits into the slot in the keel-mounted step fitting. I used the keep the boat at a club in dry dock with the mast left stepped. Now that I am trailering to all of our sailing, I am stepping and un-stepping the mast every time we sail. Is there any reason why I cannot, or should not, fix that detachable mast base into the bottom of my mast, perhaps with a couple of (removable) set screws? This would make the stepping/unstepping process a bit simpler. Thanks.
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Re: Halyard issues and Mast Step

Postby GreenLake » Sun Aug 02, 2015 8:07 pm

Why not treat the dyneema as replacement of only the wire part? You can cut short the dyneema part and terminate it in an eye (with a thimble). Into that eye you can tie a short, stiff, grippy line, just long enough to work your 4:1 tensioning system. As that line only holds 1/4 of the load (the full load being distributed over 4 parts), and as you will size it to be easy to handle, strength and stretch should not be an issue (well, I wouldn't advise shock cord 8) ).

You would use a third line (anything cheap you have lying around) to temporarily tie into the eye to pull down the halyard to the point where you can begin tensioning it. By making that a line that you can disconnect, you can either set up your 4:1 purchase so that it stays permanently rigged at the bottom of the mast and connects with a shackle, or you can merely benefit from not having that long tail from your jib halyard when the sail is up.

(For the mast related question, I've deleted the now duplicate post in the other thread)

My best answer to your question is "why not?". The only reason to not make a connection is if parts have play and must be able to move. I suspect that is not the case, but you be the judge.
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Re: Halyard issues and Mast Step

Postby tc53 » Tue Aug 04, 2015 7:01 pm

Good suggestions, Greenlake. Thanks. I would just need to make sure that whatever eyes I add will run smoothly through the sheaves at the bottom (mast step) and, I think, top of the mast. The 4-1 tensioning system is anchored under the port thwart and includes about an 18" length of wire with a SS hook on the end. This hook fit through the small eye joining the rope to wire once that eye had come through the sheave in the mast step.

As for the main, I just need a line that will not slip out of the cam, or, if the old rope/wire one is still in decent shape, perhaps just swap it out for that.

I think I will try attaching the cast mast stop into the bottom of the mast. If there is a good reason not to, I'm sure doing so will help me discover it.
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Re: Halyard issues and Mast Step

Postby GreenLake » Wed Aug 05, 2015 2:01 am

You can place the eye so that it always stays between the two sheaves. That is, when the sail is lowered, the eye is at the top of the mast, when raised, the eye is above the block at the bottom of the mast. That should be enough range to raise your sail and you can use a hard eye (with a thimble) to connect to your purchase. I had imagined a block and tackle mounted along the lower part of the mast. If that's not the case, then you either have to find a soft splice that fits the lower block, or hook a very low stretch line into the eye and leading to the purchase, so that, again, the eye would only travel between the two limiting blocks, but you wouldn't lose any tension due to stretch in the connection to the block and purchase.

(if the eye won't pass the top mast sheave, you may have to stand up to connect the sail to the halyard as it may not come down as far as with an unconstrained halyard - in practice I can't see how that would make a difference.
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Re: Halyard issues and Mast Step

Postby tc53 » Thu Aug 06, 2015 3:56 pm

Thanks again. I'm sure I can do this so that the eye spice in the end of the dyneema allows enough remaining dyneema to reach the head of the jib. We never (famous last words) disconnect/reconnect the jib halyard/head once we're on the water anyway. I'm thinking I might just cut the dyneema at the desired point (where the tensioner will need to connect, then connect the two cut ends with two non-thimbled eye spices, one through the other. If I can make these compact enough, still leaving enough room for the tensioner hook to slip into the splice in the "sail end" of the rope, I the whole connection, under load, would clear the sheave in the mast step. There will be some strength loss in the two splices, but I think there will still be plenty for the purpose.
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Re: Halyard issues and Mast Step

Postby K.C. Walker » Thu Aug 06, 2015 5:58 pm

I replaced my wire with dyneema. I used the same rope section of the halyard and just spliced in where the wire was. I use a similar jib tensioner and what I found was that I needed to make the splice on the dyneema longer than was on the wire. It's more supple so it closes up and makes it difficult to get the hook in after raising the jib, also to get it unhooked. With a long eye it's no problem.

Also, I did not use a thimble and have no problems with it running through the sheaves.
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