DS III SAILS ON DS II

Moderator: GreenLake

DS III SAILS ON DS II

Postby Beach4824 » Thu Jul 23, 2020 4:43 pm

Hey new to the forum and have a Question. I recently purchased a 76 daysailer II. Been sailing every weekend a couple of months. I came across a FB Marketplace post for an DS from 1989 and looking on the DSA website that would make it a DS III. Looking at purchasing the sails from that boat to use on my DS. Does anyone know if the sails would be a Fit for my DSII. I do not race and therefor meeting qualifications for racing is not and issue. THANKS, Chris, Ohio
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Re: DS III SAILS ON DS II

Postby Beach4824 » Thu Jul 23, 2020 5:19 pm

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Re: DS III SAILS ON DS II

Postby GreenLake » Thu Jul 23, 2020 8:41 pm

Welcome to the forum and hope you'll enjoy using your new DS.

The rig (and sails) should be identical across all models of DS.

Are the sails on your boat the originals from 1976?

You may be aware of this already, but sails are consumables like brake pads on a car: they keep well if sitting around (if not exposed to UV) but get "used" up depending on how often and how long you use them (and in what wind conditions, and whether you allow them to flog). A set of sails from 1989 could well be in worse shape if it's from a boat that's seen a lot of use. But sometimes you'll find truly "lightly used" sails and those would be worth it.

Once I got to the point where I knew enough about why the original set of sails that came with my boat really weren't good any longer, I opted for a new set instead, to get the maximum use of over the years. Am on my second new set now. Cost per trip between about $6.00 and $10.00, and hugely enjoying that "new sails" feel for the first couple of years on each set. (They are still more stiff than my old sails ever were).

Just wanted to throw that in.

You'll find more discussion in the "Sails" section of this forum.
~ green ~ lake ~ ~
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Re: DS III SAILS ON DS II

Postby Beach4824 » Fri Jul 24, 2020 4:17 am

Thanks Greenlake. My sails are not in that bad of shape. I have a couple of tears in the main which i have repaired with adheasive backed sail tape and will sew around the perimiter of the patch. The guy from FB marketplace had sent me pictures of the sails which look in excellent condition. I just cant pass up the chance to have a set of backups for $75 instead of $350ish for just a new mailsail. The picture for the main he sent yesterday didnt have the normal "DS" logo on the sail but instead had a O with a 17 set in or next to it. Any ideas if this sails age could be dated based on the logo. Im assuming its the boats original sails. THANKS Chris, Ohio
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Re: DS III SAILS ON DS II

Postby GreenLake » Fri Jul 24, 2020 10:02 am

You got me on the sail logo. Not one I've seen before. Can't hurt to have seller verify the dimensions. Unless told otherwise, I'd always assume original sails.
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Re: DS III SAILS ON DS II

Postby Beach4824 » Sat Jul 25, 2020 3:22 am

Got the sails. Made out with a rudder and tiller, and cuddy hatch. Sails are in GREAT condition, boat however was not. Boat in fair condition but from sitting outside for all these years you would need to giver a real good scrub. Boat was missing mast and boom. Basicly the seller just wanted it out of their back yard. Seller had no knowlage of sailing. Turns out the boat was an 79' not an 89'. The story was it was his grampas boat. Grampa sailed it 3 times. The third time he capsized and said thats enough sailing for me. So for $100s I got Sails used 3 times and kept in storage in basement. New rudder and tiller. and a cuddy hatch that i will use as a template for a new cuddy hatch. I'm thinking their HOOD sails but cannot find hood logo on sail only sail bag. I had a hard time pricing new sails from hood, so I priced a set at North Sails which I would say would be compairable. North sails wants roughly $2,000 for a Main and Jib. Id say I did pretty well. Going out today to test them out. Ill post pictures later.
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Re: DS III SAILS ON DS II

Postby GreenLake » Sat Jul 25, 2020 3:52 am

Looks like you lucked out! Good for you.

As far as I remember from when I last priced new sails, North were about the most expensive option. I went with an expert sail maker offering DS sails for mid-range pricing, however, he appears to have ceased operation. I obviously don't have the money to afford buying multiple sets from different places to compare, but from what I've been able to tell from photos and other info, some of the budget options may be making some small design compromises, so it's not just the offshoring that leads to the lower price point. Nothing too drastic, but I've not been too tempted that direction.

I must say I enjoy the crisp feel of new sails and will argue with myself that the price per hour on the water is quite acceptable :)
~ green ~ lake ~ ~
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Re: DS III SAILS ON DS II

Postby Beach4824 » Sun Jul 26, 2020 4:44 am

Sail insignia from new sails
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Re: DS III SAILS ON DS II

Postby Beach4824 » Sun Jul 26, 2020 4:51 am

Sail insignia from actual sail
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Re: DS III SAILS ON DS II

Postby Beach4824 » Sun Jul 26, 2020 4:59 am

New Main and Jib are bigger than the originals that came with the boat. I did not measure but i could tell while i was rigging yesterday. longer luff and foot.
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Re: DS III SAILS ON DS II

Postby GreenLake » Sun Jul 26, 2020 3:11 pm

Go to the DSA website at https://daysailer.org and look under bylaws, section 3 for the sail dimensions. Are those O'Day 17 ones larger than those measurements? If so, they would not be from a DSIII but from some other boat.

I haven't been able to find actual references for an O'Day 17 as distinct from a DaySailer, but O'Day did build multiple models in the same size range, like the Rhodes 19 and the O'Day 19 and these may not have had identical rigs, as DS1 and DSII (and DSII).

If the sails are oversize, it may not be possible to tension the luff enough. What's the verdict?
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Re: DS III SAILS ON DS II

Postby Beach4824 » Sun Jul 26, 2020 6:46 pm

Verdict is that in unfavorable light and variable wind they worked. I'd say from observation and with the help of my pops critiquing the sail trim they are a good fit maybe not the best. Nice tension on the luff and there's about a 1in left at the foot when tensioned on boom.
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Re: DS III SAILS ON DS II

Postby GreenLake » Mon Jul 27, 2020 9:55 am

Light winds are great to sort out a new boat. Sails: it depends.

My boat came with an old set of sails that may have been original, in which case they were 40 some years old. However, they were very soft (compared to their crisp replacements) which, in particular, gave the jib an advantage in really light airs. In stronger winds, those sails couldn't be trimmed at all. You want flatter sails, with the maximum camber forward in the sail, and blown-out sails simply don't want to give you that. Also, I found that the leech of the jib at some point will start to flutter in higher winds as the sails age.

I have no reason to doubt your conclusion so far that the sails aren't oversized, and will work fine for you, but you'd need a bit more wind for a full confirmation. When you put full outhaul and halyard tension you'll see whether there's enough mast and boom there to accommodate the stretch. (My new sails were a bit larger than what was on the boat originally, so I changed from a shackle to a knot for the main halyard to make sure to get maximum hoist, for example).
~ green ~ lake ~ ~
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Re: DS III SAILS ON DS II

Postby SUNBIRD » Fri Aug 27, 2021 4:47 pm

If the sails had been fro ma DS III, they would most likely fit fine on a DS I or II, but some of hte DS III boats came with roller-furling (luff-wire type) jibs and so hte jib would not have hanks. A local sailmaker could add them for you, or I think you could get the hanks from SAIL-RITE KITs on-line and add them yourself.
These sails may also have come from the same sailmaker used by an O'DAY 19 owner who posted on the O'DAY owners about his new sails being too small, and so maybe the wrong logo was put on?

If these sails came from an O'DAY 17 ,and yes there was such a class many years ago, the specs that I have seen for the O'DAY 17 list sail area as "160 sqft" and hte DS (I, II, or III) have 145 sqft of sail area. So, they may be larger than DS sails. Funny thing is, all hte pictures I've have seen of the O'DAY 17 have the Day Sailer logo on the sail...........?

Basically, the O'DAY 17 was configured as Uffa Fox originally designed the Day Sailer, with no cuddy, picture a 1960's Javelin, but built on the Day Sailer hull. George O'DAY added the cuddy to the DS against the wishes of Uffa Fox.


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Rod Johnson, "SUNBIRD"
1979 DS II, # 10201
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