Improvements for a new-to-me DaySailer

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Improvements for a new-to-me DaySailer

Postby Hesedguy » Mon Jun 10, 2019 1:36 pm

My wife and I graduated to an '83 DaySailer II from a Javelin now that our family is expanding, but after taking it out a couple times we've discovered a plethora of fixes we want to make and would like some advice.

1. CB uphaul leak: Two-fold for us... We don't want water in the bilge (there was a good bit after 2 outings), but we also don't want water squirting into the cuddy since we put all our gear in there to keep them dry :( . For the Bilge leak, Has anyone tried squishing some 3M 4200 or even 5200 into the gap then put the donut back in? Has anyone had good success keeping water out of the cuddy with the end cap on a pip nipple or some other method? Pictures would be fantastic if available.

2. CB control cleats: I'd like to replace the horn cleat for the CB with a couple of auto-release cleats like I saw on Tim Webbs TRW, but I'm not sure how to secure them to the trunk. Would I just use screws since I don't have access to the bilge-space there?

3. Jibsheet Cars: I'm not very happy with the jib cars on our boat. The sheets run through a fairlead and cam cleat mounted sideways so that to release you have to pull towards the stern (I'll put a picture up this evening). When you're hiking out it's just about impossible to release unless you have a wingspan like Michael Phelps. Anyone have a suggestion here? I don't really want to put the cams on the trunk, I like the cleaner look.

Thanks in advance!
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Re: Improvements for a new-to-me DaySailer

Postby GreenLake » Mon Jun 10, 2019 5:06 pm

I'll leave the DSII specific questions (centerboard leaks) to the DSII owners and experts here.

For jib sheets, you basically have three options.

Cleat on the car, cleat on the trunk, and cleat on the opposite side.

If the cleat on the car rotates so it is in line with the direction of the jib, then you'll need to either pull forward or aft (depending on one of two possible cleat orientations). And, because you are so far away from the cleat, the angle between setting and releasing the cleat translates into "wingspan" when you hike.

Cleats on the trunk are a compromise. I sail my DS in an area that often has light to moderate winds (with no hiking), but also more vigorous days. The center mounted cleats are convenient for the former, but still easy enough to cleat / uncleat while hiking. Some people use secondary fairleads or wire straps to hold the sheets captive; I don't, so I can pull the sheets from anywhere, and only need to align them when I want to cleat.

I've sailed on boats where (non-captive) cleats were mounted on the opposite deck. Very easy to cleat while hiking, but you better not forget to release before moving sides.

You could do a combination. Have cleats in the center and on the opposite deck. (The former for light wind days, and the latter for hiking). I did take note of the fact that you dislike the "clutter" or having cleats on the CB trunk, but I think it's best to work through an issue like that based on functional difference among possible solutions.

For completeness, I'd like to note that my DS has a peculiar fitting that was on the boat on top of the CB trunk and that I only lately realized what it was for. It's a horn cleat that looks asymmetric. The trick with it, is that one side will "jam" a sheet, so that you can cleat a sheet without having to laboriously belay it. (Requires that the cleat is matched to the line diameter).

You could use one of those on the CB trunk for light wind days (less force on the sail) and non-captive cam cleats on the opposite deck, for when you are hiking.

(I use that "spare" horn cleat to secure fenders when docking - it's near the widest point of the boat, so that cleat is in the right place).
~ green ~ lake ~ ~
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Re: Improvements for a new-to-me DaySailer

Postby TIM WEBB » Mon Jun 10, 2019 10:49 pm

Hesedguy wrote:My wife and I graduated to an '83 DaySailer II from a Javelin now that our family is expanding, but after taking it out a couple times we've discovered a plethora of fixes we want to make and would like some advice.

1. CB uphaul leak: Two-fold for us... We don't want water in the bilge (there was a good bit after 2 outings), but we also don't want water squirting into the cuddy since we put all our gear in there to keep them dry :( . For the Bilge leak, Has anyone tried squishing some 3M 4200 or even 5200 into the gap then put the donut back in? Has anyone had good success keeping water out of the cuddy with the end cap on a pip nipple or some other method? Pictures would be fantastic if available.

2. CB control cleats: I'd like to replace the horn cleat for the CB with a couple of auto-release cleats like I saw on Tim Webbs TRW, but I'm not sure how to secure them to the trunk. Would I just use screws since I don't have access to the bilge-space there?

3. Jibsheet Cars: I'm not very happy with the jib cars on our boat. The sheets run through a fairlead and cam cleat mounted sideways so that to release you have to pull towards the stern (I'll put a picture up this evening). When you're hiking out it's just about impossible to release unless you have a wingspan like Michael Phelps. Anyone have a suggestion here? I don't really want to put the cams on the trunk, I like the cleaner look.

Thanks in advance!


Hi,

For the CB control cleats, I just screwed them to the side of the CB trunk, and never had any issues. You only need the auto-release cleat for the downhaul - a regular one is fine for the uphaul.

My CB UH leak fix is pretty well documented in my gallery and associated forum posts. It worked great, with no leaks into the bilge or cuddy after the fix.

Hope this helps!

- Tim
Tim Webb
1979 DS2 10099 The Red Witch
(I used to be Her "staff", in the way dogs have owners and cats have staff, but alas no longer ... <pout>)
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Re: Improvements for a new-to-me DaySailer

Postby Hesedguy » Tue Jun 11, 2019 1:32 pm

GL thanks for the tips. I took a look at the jib cars last night, this is what they look like:
2676
I might try to bend the mount for the cleat back (looks like it is scored to make this easier). The real problem with it's current setup is that if the sheet is pulled from just about anywhere in the cockpit it automatically cleats, if I bend it back it might just be enough to make it workable. If not I'll probably put cleats on the CB trunk, we're used to that from our previous boat.

Thanks Tim, I found your posts and pictures. What kind of Silicone and putty did you use? How has the Silicone fared? I feel like it would get pretty torn up after a few outings.
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Re: Improvements for a new-to-me DaySailer

Postby GreenLake » Tue Jun 11, 2019 4:09 pm

There's effectively a sector in which the line will cleat, and a sector in which it can be released. Bending may move the boundary between those sectors so that it points across the boat, instead of aft. However, the transition isn't 100% crisp: there will be a minimal angle between where it positively releases under pressure and where it auto-cleats. You can determine that angle even with the current setup. Just make sure that the "wing span" needed to get the jib sheet to span that minimal angle from across the boat ends up acceptable. If it isn't, you can save yourself the attempt at bending, because that won't change that minimal angle.

Thanks for the picture, your cars don't pivot around a vertical axis at all - which is, of course how it has to be, otherwise it would follow you if you tried to release. But w/o the picture I had not been clear on that.
~ green ~ lake ~ ~
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Re: Improvements for a new-to-me DaySailer

Postby TIM WEBB » Tue Jun 11, 2019 10:27 pm

Hesedguy wrote:Thanks Tim, I found your posts and pictures. What kind of Silicone and putty did you use? How has the Silicone fared? I feel like it would get pretty torn up after a few outings.

I haven't had the boat for 3 years, and I did the fix about 4 years before that, but I think it was a 2-part epoxy on the threads, and just some marine silicone I had lying around that I put in the hole around the cable. Actually I did not expect the silicone to hold up well at all, but the cable rides on the lower edge of the fitting, without moving around in the hole, so it (the silicone) stayed put for as long as I had the boat.
Tim Webb
1979 DS2 10099 The Red Witch
(I used to be Her "staff", in the way dogs have owners and cats have staff, but alas no longer ... <pout>)
TIM WEBB
 
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Re: Improvements for a new-to-me DaySailer

Postby Hesedguy » Tue Jun 08, 2021 1:24 am

Super late update on this, that's what happens with a second kid and now a dog.

For issue 1, I ended up squooshing some silicone I had on hand into the repaired CB uphaul hole and that's helped significantly with keeping the cuddy dry, so much so that I'd forgotten I'd even done the repair. Also, turns out the bilge drain was the main source of our water entry. Reseated with 4200(?) and the plug actually screwed in straight not cross-threaded :roll: and we've had a dry bilge ever since.

For issue 2 and 3 they haven't been that big of a deal, at least not enough to actually work on. Though, I did order some auto-release jam cleats to replace the horn.
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Re: Improvements for a new-to-me DaySailer

Postby GreenLake » Tue Jun 08, 2021 3:27 am

Happy to hear that you are still sailing and thanks for checking back. How are kids and dogs as crew? Or do you use your DS to escape them all :) ?
~ green ~ lake ~ ~
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Re: Improvements for a new-to-me DaySailer

Postby Hesedguy » Tue Jun 08, 2021 2:37 pm

It's mostly a family affair, though occasionally I do need to escape and go fast (we're often reefed and jib down for comfort with the kids). Our oldest, just turned 3, is starting to help out as crew, her younger sister at 16mos. makes a decent passenger. The dog, Able Seaman, is living up to his name.
Image
Image
Last edited by Hesedguy on Tue Jun 08, 2021 3:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Improvements for a new-to-me DaySailer

Postby GreenLake » Tue Jun 08, 2021 3:54 pm

Sounds like great fun. Looks like your images didn't come through. I looked at your post and the links you are trying to use are very long and complex with all sorts of "magic numbers" used in tracking encoded in them. Our forum software likes simple links, ending in .jpg. Most people here just use the "upload attachment" after resizing their photos a bit.
~ green ~ lake ~ ~
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Re: Improvements for a new-to-me DaySailer

Postby Hesedguy » Tue Jun 08, 2021 4:00 pm

Helps if I actually share the pictures in Google Photos, too :-P
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Re: Improvements for a new-to-me DaySailer

Postby GreenLake » Tue Jun 08, 2021 4:59 pm

Working now, very nice!
~ green ~ lake ~ ~
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