What is the mast sole made of?

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What is the mast sole made of?

Postby hnash53 » Fri Apr 14, 2017 12:11 pm

I have a DS II with the support post in the cuddy cabin supporting a mast hinge above the deck.

I am wondering, what is the mast sole made of where the screws go into the support post's base? Is it wood? (I sure hope not.) Is it fiberglass?

Thanks.
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Re: What is the mast sole made of?

Postby Alan » Fri Apr 14, 2017 5:55 pm

That question came up recently. The section of mast below the hinge (between the cuddy roof and the cuddy sole) rests on a metal compression post. There's a photo of my mast (1980 DSII) at this thread:

viewtopic.php?f=11&t=5474
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Re: What is the mast sole made of?

Postby hnash53 » Sat Apr 15, 2017 10:14 am

Your link did not work.

I need to know what the compression post screws into under the cuddy sole. Is it wood? Is it fiberglass?
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Re: What is the mast sole made of?

Postby GreenLake » Sat Apr 15, 2017 1:50 pm

If the link still does not work, the topic is entitled "DSII Mast Step Support" and you can easily find it under "Repair and Improvement" from the "Board Index" page. I think that should give you a more concrete idea.

I don't own a DSII, so I can't give you any qualified opinion. However, some people have reported a wood block (see http://forum.daysailer.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=873). Other posts you might find useful include http://forum.daysailer.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=873.

If you search outside the forum via google, you can use something like "site:forum.daysailer.org DSII mast step" as your search term to limit the search to this forum. That brings up a wealth of earlier discussions of this.
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Re: What is the mast sole made of?

Postby Alan » Sun Apr 16, 2017 11:25 am

DSII compression post resized.jpg
DSII compression post resized.jpg (189.65 KiB) Viewed 10390 times


Here's the photo from the other thread. It's a metal post that extends from under the cuddy sole to the keelson.

With a combination of determination and gymnastics, you can look at your own compression post by holding a small inspection mirror in one of the inspection port holes aft of the cuddy bulkhead - shining a flashlight into the mirror will illuminate the bilge area so you can see into it.

Or you can hold a small camera in the hole and take photos of the bilge until you get one that shows the post. This may take several tries.

Or you can install an inspection port in the cuddy sole - just be sure not to cut the two crosswise stringers shown in the photo.
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Re: What is the mast sole made of?

Postby Skippa » Sun Nov 05, 2017 8:07 am

I realize this post is several months old now but here is what I have found on my 1980 DSII,
The mast step in the cuddy is actually about 2 inches aft of the compression post. The mast step is screwed into a plank of wood that is glassed into the underside of the cuddy floor. The wood appears to extend from just aft of where the eye strap and turning blocks for the centerboard uphaul and downhaul are located, forward and favoring the starboard side to about a foot or so forward of the mast step. The wood is around 3/4 inch thick and is covered with a layer of fiberglass.
Hope this helps.
Kevin
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Re: What is the mast sole made of?

Postby Alan » Sun Nov 05, 2017 5:33 pm

Hmmmmmm. I wonder if someone at the factory glassed the compression post into the keelson slightly askew, then realized that they had made a mistake and glassed the plywood reinforcement into the underside of the cuddy floor before they put the cockpit molding on.

Otherwise, it might be some kind of damage repair, but I'm having a hard time imagining what kind of damage woulds have called for that kind of fix.

By the way, the arrow in my photo is actually pointing to a built-in fiberglass flotation tank which I had been completely unaware of. I assume it's standard, but who knows?
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Re: What is the mast sole made of?

Postby GreenLake » Sun Nov 05, 2017 7:34 pm

It's kind of hard to tell where that arrow is pointing. Is it supposed to be "pointing" at whatever pixel is closest to the tip, no matter how deep that is in the background of the picture? Or do we follow its direction until it intersects something that's closer to the foreground?

Haven't been in a DSII in a while, but I believe you are correct there's a bit of a tank forward. In the picture that would form the background. There seem to be a pair of stringers, the underside of which is above the arrow.

Then there are some light gray bits that I can't place / identify. I assume the thing looking like a light brown bit of 2x4 is the keelson and the shape to the right of it is part of the CB trunk? If so, forward direction along the centerline of the boat would be 30 degrees away from bottom right corner. Is that what we are seeing?

About the possibility of a mistake during manufacturing: not unlikely, in keeping with relatively abysmal quality control in industrial production during those decades. And building boats like these was at best done in a semi-industrial manner. Almost curious to find out if anything changed with the way the current DS's are put together.
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Re: What is the mast sole made of?

Postby Alan » Sun Nov 05, 2017 8:24 pm

The arrow tip is just below, and meant to point to, the bottom edge of the flotation tank's rear wall. It isn't relevant to the question about the compression post, but this was the best photo of the compression post I had - I probably shouldn't have mentioned the arrow and confused the issue. :D

I've put the arrow where it should be for this topic, so it points to the compression post. Here's the new photo:

DSII compression post - resized.jpg
DSII compression post - resized.jpg (188.95 KiB) Viewed 10106 times


The bit that looks like brown 2X4 is a length of flotation foam, as are the two gray bits to the left and the single gray bit to the right. They're too long to pull out through the inspection ports without breaking them, so I suspect they were dropped into the hull during construction, before the cockpit molding was attached.

GL, you're right about the 30 degrees, and the portion of the centerboard trunk, and the two crosswise stringers.

Actually, looking at the compression post, and the compression post in one other DSII, it looks to me like it was made in two pieces, top and bottom. (The top portion is narrower and fits inside the bottom portion, and the drips of goop on the lower portion were probably glue that was squeezed out when the two pieces were joined.)

O'Day must have glassed the bottom portion to the hull and the top portion to the underside of the cuddy floor, then hoped they lined up when the cockpit molding was lowered onto the hull molding. If they didn't line up, well, desperate times call for desperate measures, like maybe the plywood in Kevin's boat.

That's my theory, anyway.
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Re: What is the mast sole made of?

Postby TIM WEBB » Sun Nov 05, 2017 8:46 pm

Chris Behnke's 1980 DS2 developed a crack in the cuddy sole, around the mast step, caused by a similar misalignment between step and compression post. He ended up cutting out a section of the sole around the step, rebuilding/realigning the post, then glassing the section back in.
Tim Webb
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(I used to be Her "staff", in the way dogs have owners and cats have staff, but alas no longer ... <pout>)
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Re: What is the mast sole made of?

Postby ChrisB » Tue Nov 07, 2017 2:40 pm

Tim is correct. On my DS-II, the compression post was mis-aligned with the step casting by 1.5 - 2 inches. Under the cockpit/cuddy floor molding, there was a piece of plywwod glassed to the underside of the molding. The step casting screwed into this plywood. The mis-alignment was not a problem until 30 years of getting wet caused the plywood to disintegrate. Then the entire downward force of the mast pushed on the thin fiberglass of the cuddy floor and cracked it. My repair was to cut out a 14" square of the floor and install a longer piece of pvc pipe as the compression post (longer by the thickness of the disintegrated plywood). I glassed the floor piece back in place and glassed a new piece of plywood on the top of the cuddy floor. The step casting was screwed to the new plywood. It raised the mast 3/4" or so so I had to play with the rig afterward.
Chris B.
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