DaySailer.org Forum

I'm planning on increasing the purchase power of my vang from 3:1 to 15:1. The purpose for this is for vang sheeting. I think that I need to also change my gooseneck set up which is now the sliding gooseneck in the sail track. I already get a disconcerting boom shift in the gooseneck when tacking up wind with the vang on tight. Does anybody have any thoughts on what would be best?

Thanks for your thoughts!

KC

15:1 sounds a bit extreme. Can you elaborate why you think you need to go that far? Also, how are you planning to realize that (which blocks, etc). Usually, for something with limited travel, like a vang, it's cheaper to use a cascade. A cascade gives powers of two, so combined with your existing vang tackle, you could get 6:1 with a single cascade, or 12:1 with a dual one. This would limit the maximum range of travel to 1/4, but for a vang that should not be problem.

As for the gooseneck: any forces you create with that super-vang of yours are also transmitted to the mast...

I think for what I want to try, which is used regularly with Thistles and racing DaySailers, 15:1 it's probably not too extreme. I bought a couple of nice little Ronstan triple blocks off eBay. My inspiration was Phill Root’s photos of his set up.


I've been reading Stuart H. Walker's Manual of Sail Trim among other things which has me thinking about more sail control. Good sail trim is what makes a boat go faster.

Here's a quickie article that addresses what I'm trying to work on. http://www.sailingbreezes.com/Sailing_B ... ll0800.htm

KC

I went from 15:1 that I copied from Dave Keran three years ago to 20:1 soon after Dave finished rigging Rebel Banana #11026 earlier this spring. The previous Allspar mast and Dyer boom on #2772 had a gooseneck that slid into the sail slot and I was slowly turning it into unrecognizable piece of Stainless Steel. The newer Ballenger Mast and Boom that I switched to last year have the standard Ballenger Gooseneck assembly that easily handle the significant loads created vangsheeting the Main. Keep in mind I run a 1:1 Snipe style bridle Mainsheet so I use the boomvang to control the Main Leech as well as lower mast bend. I alsoo copied Dave in leading the boomvang aft to a 360 Cleat (commonly found on a Thistle) to the centerboard trunk just in front of the Mainsheet Cleat Assembly. That easily allows me to control both lines with both sitting on my leg as I hike and steer . The boomvang control line is always red as that's the "Panic Button" when bad things happen.

K.C. Walker wrote:I think for what I want to try, which is used regularly with Thistles and racing DaySailers, 15:1 it's probably not too extreme. I bought a couple of nice little Ronstan triple blocks off eBay. My inspiration was Phill Root’s photos of his set up.
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That picture shows a 6:1 tackle with a 2:1 cascade, so it should be 12:1, if I got my math right. As I wrote before, a cascade limits the maximum travel, in this case by half, but over a standard block and tackle of same purchase it has the advantage that the friction can be lower.

K.C. Walker wrote:I've been reading Stuart H. Walker's Manual of Sail Trim among other things which has me thinking about more sail control. Good sail trim is what makes a boat go faster.

Here's a quickie article that addresses what I'm trying to work on. http://www.sailingbreezes.com/Sailing_B ... ll0800.htm

OK, I see where you are going with this. And yes, the standard gooseneck isn't up to that.

Some of the folks around QYC use a fixed gooseneck. It's riveted to the mast and the boom just slides onto a receiving post on the gooseneck. Looks like a nice system, haven't heard any complaints about it. I don't know if there is one available for the old standard boom, the ones I have seen are on newer booms (different cross section). If you want more info let me know and I can ask one of the fellows who I know uses it.

Mike,

I've got the Allspar/Dwyer set up. I was thinking with the added purchase power I might have problems. I guess that I might as well rig for 20:1 to start out with. Good idea! I'll rig the panic button with red.

I hadn't considered going with the snipe style bridal. I was trying to decide between the rope triangle traveler or the simpler bridle like Dave rigged his boat. I noticed that Dave has his bridal rigged forward of the usual traveler location. I don't suppose you have a thoughts on that, do you? It seems like using vang sheeting makes a traveler less relevant, so the simple bridal should work.

Thanks for the info!

KC

Rather than modify/update the existing Allspar Mast/Dyer Boom I took the easy way out by buying #1154 which had a nearly new Ballenger Tapered Mast and very stiff Boom with internal outhaul that I switched over to #2772. There are several different ways to modify/update your current set-up to handle the load created by vangsheeting. The Snipe style Mainsheet creates less mainsheet in the bilge, less mainsheet to release and pull in at mark roundings but requires in my case the use of a pair of ratchet blocks. One off the boom and the other at the mainsheet base pedestal to handle the loads that causes my tennis elbow to flare up. With vangsheeting the mainsheet acts as the traveler (horizontally) while the boomvang controls the angle of the boom and twist of the leech (vertically). E-mail me at mike@gpsawnings.com and I'll send you a photograph that has the 20:1 Boomvang, Cunningham and Ballenger Gooseneck in it. Mike

Well… it does seem like a good way to upgrade. And yes, I'd love to get photos so I will drop you an e-mail. I've been sailing with the 3:1 center boom sheeting and don't much like it. It does have the advantage of not too much sheet in the cockpit, which is good. I do know what you mean about the tennis elbow, though. 3:1 in the center position takes a lot of effort when the breeze picks up. I have picked up 3 40mm Ronstan smart ratchet blocks at a good price. I'm planning on a couple for jib sheets and one for the boom. I've yet to pick up anything for the main sheet ratchet block, though.

KC

Speaking about photos. I'm curious to see yours, K.C. when your done. I might go for vangsheeting myself - eventually.