New to sailing / to DSI and the immidiate duties at hand

[seandwyer]

Hi Guys,

As stated in the subject line, I am new to sailing. I've been on a sailboat all of 1 time as part of a two day sailing class I took last spring (one day in class, one day on the water). I've wanted to sail for quite some time, and last year decided on a whim to do something about it - hence the class. Since then, having confirmed my interest, I have been reading, researching and becoming as mentally acquainted with sailing and boats as possible. But still - I don't know anything about sailing - but as least I'm not fool enough to think I do!

After a lot of thought, research and looking at different types of boats, I decided that the day sailer type was probably the best option for me, and what better sort than the original!? I recently made a final agreement to buy an O'Day Daysailer-I from a guy locally. The boat is a 1968 and although dirty and perhaps in need of some floor paint - she looks to be in good shape. She still has all the floor boards and outboard well cover. The owner has been keeping all the woodwork, sans combing, in his garage as well as the engine, rudder, tiller, sails etc. The boat, mast and boom are stored on the trailer under a tarp in a boat yard. I've never seen the mast erect, but he has agreed to go with me once and show me how to set up and sail (Nice guy!).

My question is this - what should I be thinking about? What are the important maintenance, and structural issues that I should be looking at during this Ohio March and April so I am not wasting sailing time come May? The hull is very dull looking - the owner has warned me against painting - that once painted, you always have to paint - so is there some way to improve the appearance of the fiberglass? He did paint the floor once - and as he said - it's the worst looking part of the boat - and one of the first things I will be doing. I don't know about the mast, boom, hardware etc - how to check etc. I'd thought about hitching up the trailer and running up to the local sailboat dealer and asking them to give it a once over - but it seems like this goes against my grain - I like to do things myself so I understand what is going on - especially if I need to repair something in an emergency - I'll have a better understanding of functionality etc.

In short - where do I start? I have a 40 year old boat sitting on a trailer that I think is in good shape - but before I pack it full of kids and sail off into the sunset - what do I do? Where do I begin?

Thanks in advance!!!

Sean

[Roger]

I owned one of these boats and actually wrote a book on restoring and maintaining it a few years back. The DS I is a pretty solid boat. Owners tend to be honest folk, so ask about any needed repairs, leaks etc.

Check the DS I cb lever to ensure that it is not loose or jiggly. These tend to work loose over time, and the cb hole that the shaft fits in may need to be rebuilt... not a difficult task.

Ask about leaks. The pivot bolt is the most likely suspect, and the bilge drain, the next likely. Ask if the floatation tanks are still good. Lots of folks have these replaced with foam floatation.

The original rigging was 3/32". Most owners have upgraded to 1/8".

Check the sails for crispness. If they feel like soft cloth, they are likely blown out and need replacing.

Running rigging should not be frayed, worn through on the outside layer, nor rotting.

Finally, check to see if the motor runs, and ask to have it run in a pail for a good 5 or 10 minutes.

Check for rust on the trailer, and check the bearings.

Most DS boats in decent condition will sell for around the $2k mark and up to $2.5k if in really good condition. A newer boat with top of the line equipment, may go for as high as $3k but that is rare. Beaters, (needing major work), or without boat and motor may go for as little as $1k.

Rather than take it to a dealer to have them give it the once over, take someone with you who knows something about sailing. I've sold 6 of my books in Ohio, so I know there are some Daysailer owners there that would gladly help you.

Drop me a line at roger02 att mts dott net and I can perhaps find someone near you.

Good luck with that.

[kokko]

If you read my past posts you will see I bought a derelict DS1 last March. I worked on the boat steadily and was able to sail it by May. THe original sails where shot, so I replaced them. I refinished all the woodwork on the boat, and repainted the interior hull. My centerboard mechanism was ok, but I did buy a new gasket to keep on hand.

I did not like the roller furling boom for the main, so I converted it to the conventional jiffy reef and added a topping lift.

As a general rule, plan on replacing all the running rigging, and then check the standing rigging carefully.

Let me know what you hull number is. It is on a plate at the bulkhead.

[kokko]

One more thing - I agree with others not to paint the boat.
My boat had sat untended and uncovered in a field for years. I started by powerwashing the hull inside and out. This did strip the paint from the inside hull, but I planned to repaint. The polish the hull with some polishing compound from the auto parts store. THe white stuff is pretty mild, but deep stratches can be removed with rubbing compound - the red stuff. Only use the red stuff by had, and not a power buffer.

For the inside hull I used a good quality exterior latex. I had called West Marine for their recommendation, and they recommending WM interior marine paint at ~$70/quart. I look it up and found it was basically an exterior latex house paint. I used KILZ primer, then two coats of the exterior latex, then sponged on a contrast color.

THe alternative is gelcoat.

[seandwyer]

Thanks to everyone for all the replies!

I suppose the only real way to inspect the rigging is to get the mast up and see how things work etc. I'm betting the running rigging should just be replaced so as to not worry about it. From what I recall the standing rigging seemed to be ok - no fraying etc, but I will have to check the size and see what everything looks like when erect.

As for painting - is it necessary to paint the interior of the hull? I guess I should have asked that first. It is peeling terribly, and the big ice cube laying in the bottom of the hull isn't helping. I lowered the front of the trailer so most of the water could run out, and manaually removed as much ice as I could - will this hurt the hull? I was sort of thinking about scraping (gently) the loose paint up and not repainting - help here would be nice since it may be a case of once painted always painted (like the person that painted my basement floor - I'd like to wring their neck). As for the hull - buffing compound seems to suggest the removal of gel coat and thus shining of the surface. How many times can you do this before causing the finish to be too thin? Do people reaply gel coat? Kokko I think suggested the potential of gel coat inside the hull - is this a preffered but terribly expensive option? I also wonder about the antifouling paint that used to be on the bottom. Most of it has worn away, making it look poor. Should I reaply even if I plan to only store the boat on the trailer - never keeping it in the water more than a few days at a time? Oh - and this brings up the question of how you support the boat so you can work on the bottom or the center board - since being on the trailer seems like where it has to stay as long as it's out of water.

One more question for now. How do I gain access to the flotation tanks for inspection and where would a person put the noodles that were suggested if I find the styrofoam to be water logged? I don't see any access or opening to the area beneath the seats - it seems like a one piece construction with the boat.

Thanks everyone - I can see there is a wealth of knowledge out there!

[kokko]

Whew! I hope I can remember it all.

No, yo don't have to pain the inner hull, and by that I mean the painted fiberglass areas. THe cockpit seats are finished with a gel coat - don't paint hose. THey can be cleaned and buffed out. All other sufaces were painted at the facotry - typically some off white paint with some splashes of a darker color to visually mask the unfinished (un gel-coated) fiberglass.
As I said, I use a good quality exterior latex and I acheived sometehing very like the original painted surface. I was advised you can use gel coat. It can be brushed or rolled, but I would use an epoxy primer first.

Bottom paint. THis is a toughie. You really don't need it if you store it on the trailer. Is it a hard bottom paint or an ablative? An abvblative you may be able to buff off. Try it and see if you are happy with how it looks. If it is a hard coat, you might be better off to repaint with bottom paint rather than try to strip the old off - although it can be done.

Centerboard. THere is a lot here on accesing the centerboard. Basically you lower the tongue of the trailer, suppor the transom, then jack the front up so the back end is lifted off the trailer. You should be able to access the centerboard.

Polishing. Most polishes or polishing compounds (the white stuff) will not remove very much gel coat - just the oxidation layer. THe red stuff is a much more agressive abrasive and should onlly be used on small areas and by hand. Have at it with polish and then hit the deep scratches with the red stuff. THen wax.

[persephone]

Hi Sean,

Welcome to the Daysailer community.
A pointer on any painting you end up doing. Preparation is the most important step. Scrape or wire brush any loose paint off, then clean, clean and clean again. For the final cleaning you might want to use an autobody de-greasing solution (prep-sol or acryli-clear are the two I am familiar with, you should be able to find them or a similar product at an autobody supply company) and wipe everything down carefully prior to painting. This will help with adhesion and longevity of your new paint.
Generally speaking with paints, a two part epoxy paint will cure to a harder, more durable finish. The down side is they are more difficult to work with.
Something that I thought of in reference to it's time on a trailer. How does the underside shape look? I saw a pair of DS2 once that had been left to take on hundreds of gallons of water and the bottoms were terribly deformed and cracking where the bunk boards and supports were.
I agree that getting someone familiar with the DS to look your boat over with you would be better than taking it to a general dealer/service facility.
On the mast and boom, obviously check for straightness. Also inspect the rivets or hardware that attaches the rigging and hardware to the spars. Look for signs of corrosion (most of the rivets and hardware should be stainless, but the mast and boom are aluminum). Corrosion on aluminum appears as a powdery white residue. A little bit of surface corrosion is normal, if the metal looks flaky, pitted or heavily powdered it might indicate a problem. The attachment points are most vulnerable because of the different metals coming into contact with each other.
I hope this helps.

[Roger]

is to careen it. With the mast up and boat on the trailer, tilt the trailer until the transom touches the soft grass, tie a line between the transom and a tree, then slowly pull the trailer out from underneath it. Do this by hand.

Once the boat is on the ground, place some old cushions or life jackets under one side where the gunwale will eventually touch the ground. Standing to one side of the boat and about 20 feet away, pull on the main halyard so that the masthead starts to tilt down to the ground. This is easily done by one person. Once the mast is within reach, tie it down to something solid on the ground. A few cinder blocks, or even a screw in the ground style dog leash anchor will work. Now you are free to work on the exposed bottom of the boat.

From experience, it is easier to do the hull that is at chest level, then careen the boat over to the other side, to do the other half of the hull. This is easier than bending over to do the part that is hard to reach. I painted the boat this way over a couple of days, letting each half of the boat dry overnight before careening the boat to the other side. On the third day, I reloaded it by reversing the process with the trailer. With the transom still tied to a tree, I winched the trailer back under the boat by hand. Again this is easy for one person to do alone, and when the boat gets to the balance point, you can set the tongue down quite easily, then keep winching in on to the trailer rollers.

Careening can be done with bigger boats as well, but usually done in shallow water near the shore.

[jpclowes]

Hi Sean
Welcome to the group. I see you are in Cincinnati. We have a fleet up here in Columbus, and will start sailing in about a month. (Docks go in at our club on April 4.) You are welcome to come up and join us any time. (With or without your boat.) Sometimes seeing how other boats are set up is the best way to decide how to set up your own.

BTW our fleet is in the process of restoring a DSII that we are donating to our learn to sail program, and are doing a lot of the same things you are.

What lake do you plan to sail on? There used to be a fleet at Cowan, but I think it has gone away.

[jpclowes]

Sean
I put inspection ports in the top of the seat. I put them in the front part of the seat. If I had it to do over again, I would put them towards the stern. I thought about putting them in the side like Chris did, but the cutting was more complicated than I was able to do. I also wanted a bigger port than I could easily fit in that area.

The bigger ports allow you to get the foam out more easliy. They also allow you to put the noodles in more easily.

[kokko]

Inspired by your posts, I have added inspection ports to the to-do list. THe Truelove comes out of storage 4/6 so it is time to plan.
Did you use 4" or 6" ports? There was some discussion about placement of the ports in the seats - either fore or aft, and I would like to hear more about that.

[wrmann]

I got the larger ports. I put them in the front of the seat in my DS I. I did this so I could remove the old foam blocks and replace them with pool noodles. I also put an inspection port on the forward floatation chamber. I always remove the inspection port covers when the boat is tied to the dock. That way the seat chamber can dry out in the sun.

[seandwyer]

The idea of inspection ports both intrigues as well as frightens me! I can see how it might be nice to see inside of the void, but cutting into the boat seems a scary activity.

So here is the question - first - how is water getting into this area if it is sealed shut to begin with - and if you wanted to remove the styrofoam, how does one get it to come out of such small holes? I am under the impression that the styrofoam is in large blocks - I can see putting noodles in, but I do not understand removing the existing foam. Actually, I sort of imigained an enormous one peice block that was blown into the underside seat area before assembly.

Confusing to be sure.

jpclowes - thanks for the invitation. I actually noticed the fleet in Columbus on the listing on this site - and yes, I do believe the Cincinnati fleet has disappeared - where, no one knows!?! I would like to take advantage of this - one I feel like I can at least put her in the water and know what to do once there. A question about appropriate lakes etc - I plan on Brookville Lake and other local large lakes to start with - does anyone have experience on Erie or orther great lakes? I know crossing these is probably a no-no in a Day Sailer, but what about coastal sailing? Is anyone involved with this? I've looked for organizations etc - but don't see anything on the web.

I have so much work to do - and so many more questions. Thanks!

Sean