New old boat!

[CCaps]

Hey Everyone, i'm very happy to have recently purchased a 1970 DS1 Hull #3572. I've perused this site extensively and am overwhelmed by the wealth of knowledge and support. This is my first sailboat but I've sailed Daysailers at the Community Boating Center in Providence RI, which was a fantastic place to learn how to sail. Anyways here are some pics of the boat, I'm excited to work oh her and these photos were after I removed hardware/brightwork and washed her down. I'll be doing a variety of cosmetic work/painting/varnishing/refitting, etc... The hull seems pretty sound, not cracks or blisters anywhere, it was just filthy when I got her.

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I do notice a fair amount of oil canning/hull flex where the hull meets the trailer bunks, thoughts? Dangers? Is it normal??

-Chris[/code]

[algonquin]

Congrats on your find ! I found that the restoration and resurrection process brings a lot of satisfaction and enjoyment.

I believe that the oil canning you describe is normal for the DSI, not sure about the DSII but have read that there are some DSIIs with thin skin so to speak. The DSI does stiffen when in the water and the floor boards help to distribute the crew weight but the trailer is a separate issue. Check the positions of the bunks to see if they can be moved a bit to reduce the problem you describe. I know I moved mine and it made a difference. Brad

[ctenidae]

Welcome to the wonderful addiction that is refitting Daysailers. Lots of good info and advice available on the site, that's for sure.

Make sure you enter your information HERE to help fill in any gaps in the lineage.

[kkearns]

The bunks on the trailer should align roughly with the inside edge of the seat benches. It is my understanding that this is where the hull is strongest. I strongly recommend that you move the trailer bunks, even if you have to remove and reweld them. I had a similar trailer set-up, and after only a 100 miles or so of towing, I noticed some disturbing cracks in the exterior gel coat. Because the hull of the DSI is not cored, it is very flexible and prone to damage if towed on the wrong type of trailer. I don't even tow my boat much, except for spring and fall chores. But it sits on the trailer at the lake and the damage can occur there as well. My bunks were not "adjustable" but I found a welder who did the job for about $150 (can't recall exactly), but it was money well spent.

Kevin

[kkearns]

By the way, Chris, your boat looks a lot like my 1965 (#1827) DSI. Same light blue hull. Here is a site with my "restoration" chronology. Believe me, I'm not much of a handyman and nearly all of the work was cosmetic, not structural. Believe it or not, I'm only the second owner of #1827 and she was in pretty decent shape. Take a look.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/40350223@N07/?saved=1


Best wishes with your restoration.

Kevin

[GreenLake]

Welcome!

Some people like to attack the oil canning with a radical cure. There's a long discussion on this site of K.C. Walker's project where he added a foam core to the inside hull of his DS1. ("The Core Project").

He had extensive depressions above the trailer supports, and on inspection found that the stringers (visible in your last photo) had rotted Balsa inside the glass.

If repositioning your trailer support brings some improvement, I would do that first, and sail her for a while. Then you can gage much better how far you'd like to carry stiffening her.

The fact that you don't see any cracks seems a good sign.

[CCaps]

Great info fellow Daysailers! I've got some play on my trailer bunks so I'll move those out a bit this weekend. I checked out "The Core" post and seems like quite a task, but possibly worth it in the future. Thanks again for the support, I'll try to keep good records of all my repairs so others can benefit.

Now, I've got to give her a name

[K.C. Walker]

I'll add my welcome!

It looks like you got yourself a nice boat. From the photos it looks like your boat hull is constructed a lot like the way mine was. It has the same stringer pattern and centerboard cap. These boats are fun and a little funky. I noticed a fair amount of asymmetry when overhauling my boat. I had to kind of chuckle when I looked at your photo of the bow looking back and noticed that the center area between the nonskid on the deck and on the cuddy top don't line up. This sort of thing is kind of typical but don't worry about things like that the boat sails just fine.

It's hard to get a handle on just how much hull flex is acceptable or like original. If you don't find any cracks or blisters, you've got a lot to work with. Because the boat is a planing hull boat and has a lot of flat area it "oil cans" much easier in those areas than curved surfaces. One needs to be careful not to flex these areas too much and cause fatigue which softens the boat. Even if it doesn't cause visible cracks flexing can cause micro fractures in the laminate which softens it. The best preventative for this is a good trailer with good support.

Your trailer looks pretty short and might be of some concern. The recommendations from O'Day were to support the boat as much as possible on the keel and then just balance it with bunks. In reality there isn't much keel and a lot of the weight of the boat rests behind and alongside the centerboard where it's flat. I think the solution for this is to make the bunks as long and as wide as possible. To see photos of how four-time national champion Phill Root modified his trailer in this way you can look at his photo gallery. Just click on his name, he's the moderator, and then click on personal gallery of Phill.

Looks like you're well on your way with your project and it should turn out well. I'm in North Stonington Connecticut, not far from you. Maybe we can organize a sailing get-together next summer. One of the guys on the forum here is on Buzzards Bay and we talked about a get-together up there last summer. It doesn't get much better for sailing than Narragansett Bay. Have fun!

KC

[Peterw11]

Let me also add my welcome to the site, and to DS ownership.

My DS is two years older than yours and aside from that, is identical in color and condition.

My hull flexes a bit and "oilcans", as well, especially when the floorboards are removed and it's sitting on the trailer. I think this is pretty normal and understandable, given the long, flat, span of the cockpit sole and the relative lack of additional bracing in that area.

I noticed you have the transom floorboard laying on the seat in one of your pics. I trust you have the other 6 pieces as well?

When the boards are in place and the boat's in the water, the flexing is less noticeable as they spread the weight of the crew over a larger area.

Not to worry, as it won't affect the performance or safety a bit. They all do it.

[Imgaryo1]

Let me welcome you to the Daysailer community. Always glad to see another Daysailer out on the water.

[kokko]

Since no one else has mentioned it, chances are the foam in the flotation tanks is waterlogged. Everyone discovers this. There are a lot of threads on this topic, but you have to cut access panels in to the floation tanks, yank out all the old foam blocks (about 28 cubic feet) and replace.
Most opt for closed-cell foam like swim noodles, but a few thristy souls save their one liter bottles and pack those in.

[seandwyer]

As an aside on the flotation - especially the closed foam swim noodle type - have we ever come to a conclusion about whether the amount of noodles put in the bow and bench tanks are sufficient to float the boat? I think the number of standard diameter noodles is 75. Has anyone capsized with these in place?

[kokko]

Love problems like these. I think I used 25 cubic feet of swim noodles.
Assuming the noodles weigh nothing, the displace 25 cubic feet of water, which weighs about 62 lbs per cubic foot - about 1500 lbs. Plenty for a boat that weighs 650 lbs!.

Substract the weight of the noodles - 10 lbs? add in people and gear - 400-500 lbs? Stilll plenty of bouyancy.

But the flotation tanks are much larger than 25 cubic feet. I packed in 25 cubic feet of swim noodles, but the entire volume of the floatation tanks prvides positive flotation. Ther is a lot of dead space around each noodle. if there is 30 cubic feet in the three tanks, it is supplying nearly 1960 lbs of flotation. The swim noodles are only needed if the tanks are breached. If all three are breached there is still 25 cubic foot of flotation.

[ctenidae]

I think you're wildly optimistic on your estimation, kokko. I did the math a while ago, and to make the boat unsinkable, you need 95 noodles, which no one has ever been able to fit in.

http://forum.daysailer.org/forum/viewtopi ... e&start=30

"According to the formulas here: http://www.glen-l.com/weblettr/weblette ... ation.html which seem reasonable, and assuming 1.8 as the specific gravity of solid fiberglass, I'm coming up with a negative buoyancy for the 575 pound daysailer of about 255 pounds (not accounting for the higher negative buoyancy of the mast, rigging, etc etc).

Assuming a 2lb density for the swim noodles, which seems reasonable (I've seen similar looking polyethelyne rated at 1.7), a 2.25" diameter 60" long noodle with a 1/2" hole in the middle is about 0.04 cubic feet. The net buoyancy of a noodle, then is 2.68 pounds (62 lbs per cf for fresh, 64 for salt water, less the foam's weight = 60 lbs per cubic foot net buoyancy). Which means you need at least 95 noodles to make a daysailer unsinkable. That's a lot of noodles."

[seandwyer]

ctenidae, KOKKO and all those reading along,

I'm feeling pretty uncertain about the noodle and whether it is the right material - but lets just say the bow tank and benches are filled with dry Styrofoam - like a boat straight from the factory - 1968. Would the flotation be sufficient or would it just slow things down a bit, hoping that the entire boat does not fill with water? Is there a way to make the boat unsinkable?

I'm also still wondering - anyone out there with noodles on board ever capsize? I wonder if we should be intentionally doing so in shallows just see what happens before it happens in the deep end so to speak?